I still think if ShiShio was better... that fight would of ended differently. EVEN if Kenshin never did fight how many ppl before i don't think he would of been able to beat ShiShio......

I was wondering if i'm the only person that thought about that. I mean to me kenshin is really the boss of all bossworthy bosses... but shishio would've definately killed kenshin if him neva explode

I"ve raised this point over and over again right. but.. The thing is You gotta think about it. Shishio's handicap was also the source of his immense power, steam engine effect the heat that was trapped in his body was converted to power hence his abilities. the draw back was the time cap which he had to work under in all his fights so without that handicap he might have not been a match for kenshins hiten mitsurugi ryu style. However i still prefer shi shi o sama.

Ummm you guys are forgetting a crucial point. Shishio cheated. he got information from his boy subordinate so he knew when Kenshin was gonna do his special move and planned for it. That special move, wrapped up aoshi, and the boy so it was an unfair advantage that shishio had. Kenshin lost alot of blood people, he was severly weakened from the other fights come on now. Had he been on full and on equal footing that fireman would have been dead no long talking. He cheated twice to, run him sword through him girl and put a deep wound in kenshin, hide a stash of gun powder in his gloves so blow it up on kenshin, cheater cheater cheater. could not have won sword and techniques against sword and techniques

Shishi-Oh might have cheated but you still fail to see his greatness. After taking a direct hit with kenshins Ultimate attack, [ which no one has done before and stood up ] ShiShio Was able to get right back up. That sir Is Nothing less than amazing, its the reason why people always wished shisio didn't have a time limit on fighting because he would have pwned kenshin given 5 more minutes.

thats true, I agree, if a time limit didn't exist on how long shishi-oh can fight then he would have been able to get back up and continue fighting Kenshin who was on the brink

u know what i am gonna watch kenshin and clear this up,i have heard this debate a lot at school and i am tired of hearin it.

People- how can you be so unfair? Firstly, if you allow Shi Shi oh to fight without a time limit you have to allow Kenshin to fight with a cutting sword, no previous fights and fresh from a good nights sleep.
Of course none of that actually happened so we are left with some handicapps. Shishioh has a time limit so he is forced to use slasher tactics to end the fight quickly. Kenshin is bruised, beat down, his technique is exposed and he is slightly slower than usual. Therefore we should take the fight as it stands.
Kenshin is fresh from a fight with ShiShioh's prodigy and one of the greatest fighters in Japan... I mean really.
Therefore, in my informed opinion you have to take the match as it stands. Kenshin won because he was the last man standing. Given different circumstances Kenshin would probably have won. His only handicapp was that he had to go through two major fights, being blasted by gunpowder etc. If it was a fight based on natural circumstances Kenshin would have killed quickly. Shishioh's handicapp is natural for him since ten years prior in the Slashing era. Natural ShiShioh has to have the timelimit.

Kenshin kills Shishioh.

i have not see this fight but guys stop talkin about handicaps and whos is the better fighter and who is more powerful. kenshin won the fight it doesn't matter how he did it he won, end of story. maybe he is not the better fighter but he won and thats what matters

There is no way to tell who would've won the battle, even if you give kenshin the cutting sword and wake up early and have big breakfast and warm up and stuff. Kenshin is Good, shishio is also good (although he is a cheater) so the fight would depend on basically what profound said about the last man standing.

I personally think given those conditions Kenshin would've whooped shishio's ass

could have, would have, should have, in a fight it doesn't matter who is stronger all that matters is the person who wins

Well in this case it matters

Kenshin would win cuz everyone who was with kenshin, would step in and chop shishio to pieces. But then again the crazy bastard rolling with shishio would blow the place up same time suh....

Kenshin would win cuz everyone who was with kenshin, would step in and chop shishio to pieces. But then again the crazy bastard rolling with shishio would blow the place up same time suh....

Incorrect. None of Kenshin's associates, not even Aoshi, are able to fight against Shishioh. They tried and were dispelled with the literal wave of a hand. So no.
And even though Malloc-x doesn't like to hear it- it matters!

kenshin won booooooooooo, there is nothin u can do to change that.

kenshin won booooooooooo, there is nothin u can do to change that.

Why you being so anti-communication? If you don't want to contribute to this thread you can avoid posting. No need to start hating.

Another thing about Shishioh. He was Katsura's replacement hitman when Himura was called out to be more active in the war. Though qualified it is not my understanding that he was rated on the same level as Kenshin. Virus may be able to verify.


--Addition--

Near the end of the Shogun Era Kenshin was the most feared man of the era. It can be argued that since it is his show he was cast in a more favourable light. ShiShi-oh was there as well, fighting on the same side as Himura. Himura faced and defeated the Shinsing-gumi. He left the scene for a decade afterwards and returned unscathed. ShiShi-oh got caught, cut, burnt and every conceivable torture measure. Who is the bigger man? It speaks to the quality of the fighter and the raw power concept I started earlier. ShiShi-oh without his 'fire curse' is still the weaker fighter.
I know I stretched it a little but I think it adds another dimension to the school that thinks that Kenshin deserved his victory and given different circumstances would have retained his victory.

Another thing about Shishioh. He was Katsura's replacement hitman when Himura was called out to be more active in the war. Though qualified it is not my understanding that he was rated on the same level as Kenshin. Virus may be able to verify.


--Addition--

Near the end of the Shogun Era Kenshin was the most feared man of the era. It can be argued that since it is his show he was cast in a more favourable light. ShiShi-oh was there as well, fighting on the same side as Himura. Himura faced and defeated the Shinsing-gumi. He left the scene for a decade afterwards and returned unscathed. ShiShi-oh got caught, cut, burnt and every conceivable torture measure. Who is the bigger man? It speaks to the quality of the fighter and the raw power concept I started earlier. ShiShi-oh without his 'fire curse' is still the weaker fighter.
I know I stretched it a little but I think it adds another dimension to the school that thinks that Kenshin deserved his victory and given different circumstances would have retained his victory.

He was burned... i thought he got caught in a burning building or something of the sort. Cho, you see what happen wen u dont watch something in a while. U goin mek me watch over kenshin again u know.

I agree with this though, again Kenshin would probably pwn shishio. The hitenmitsurugi style 9 headed dragon light is simply brilliant. I highly doubt shishio wouldve been able to stand up to many of these attacks.

And yes please remember, none of kenshins associates, could even think about tryin to fight shishio (even though they did). No way would the hurt him though. Shishio is on another level, just like kenshin. BTW Aoshi is one of ma other fav characters in the series. Twin swords just hype

I cant remember what Aoshi's weapons are called but they're certainly not swords, they're the same things that aki uses form soul calibur its more of a merger between a sword and a knive. high speed attacks beccause of its light weight but.. less damage than whats given buy an actuall katana.

And dude Shi Shi o will always be the man. Look how he trained Soujiro. That kid was awesome.. Come on.. And he's just too cool. When kenshin said Shi Shio the meji era's dead and he replied in fierce Japanese "AS LONG AS I WEIRD THIS MUGEN $@@ [ name of his katana ], the meji era lives on ]". It wasn't exactly what he said but something like that, Was too cool.

If you people want to get Himura Kenshin eps to be reeducated I will try to facilitate. Shishi-oh was drenched in oil and burned. I watched over the episode detailing the story yesterday. Trust me people, you need to revisit Rurouni Kenshin- watching it again is still tough.

Its true, he was burnt. He said so himself and they showed flashbacks...short flashbacks, but flashback non the less.

I agree with profound on all that was said. Especially:
He left the scene for a decade afterwards and returned unscathed. ShiShi-oh got caught, cut, burnt and every conceivable torture measure. Who is the bigger man?Not to mention he changed his sword to the reverse edge..... The man could a kill countless ppl, Soujirou, aoshi, hiko... the list goes on.

But you have to admit... Soujirou was decent competition... well done kid.

Aoshi uses a Kodachi along with kempo :boxing

If you wanted to elevate the debate you could probably consider that everyone Kenshin fights has a fatal flaw which he exploits. Every battle Kenshin fought after the ShiShi-oh saga had people wth special techniques. Seta (the protoge) had the flaw where Kenshin got him to become emotional. Aoshi... well, Kenshin just done him. Amakusa- he had a flaw as well, not to mention the dude motion picture. A true fighter must know his enemy and exploit his flaws.
ShiShi-oh tried to do that by getting insider information and putting Kenshin through two fights. However, guess what, ShiShi-oh's flaw was bigger than Kenshin's.

Seems to me that the crowd agrees. If put in different circumstances the outcome would remain the same.

the starter of the thread should create a poll

We dont need to go that far, just listen to Profound, or watch the eps through opened eyes, u cant imagine the amount of time we sat down and watched RK, from when it used to come on CVM tv, dubbed not subtitles, to when we got the seasons after shishio plus those before from di net, to when it came on adult swim... those were the days

Run a poll yes, see how many people really think Kenshin couldn't done ShiShi-oh again and again.

Okay heres the thing. You people starting to take away from the prestige of the fight now. It was a great fight one in which was made by the creators to seem like a close call but good eventually overcame evil ambitions. in the end Kenshin realised his life was to be put on the line to save the future of the ones he loves. You could almost taste the blood dripping form Kenshin and feel the determination as he tries to get up after every clash, i was just as astonished as he was when shishio pushed the sword through his girl. but this fight was different from others in this way: usually when the protagonist sees an act of meaningless violence he gets really angry and charges off beating the antagonist to a pulp. this was different, Kenshin was faced with a real, equal or bigger problem that he could handle at the moment, he could only stay and watch and save his strength, silently his insides scream for an end to this madman. at every instance, when you feel Kenshin cant have any more power, its just over, he seems to find some of the strongest attacks... Nine headed dragon light?? reverse the sword and hit shishio with the hilt?? The guy basically came back to life at one point, he just sat there eyed rolled up mouth open just on his knees.

What im saying is, lets argue and such without deteriorating from the real awesomeness of the anime, the sheer brilliance of the creators of such an epic battle

The poll is kinda biased but I guess it can work wid. Remember that inherent to ShiShi-oh's time limit is directly linked to his source of greatest power. Therefore to say no time limit is to say have no real power. But, even without the time limit a fair fight would only have one winner. If you aren't sure who read my sig.

I cant say shishio would win, even though he taught soujiro, i haven't seen him move as fast as kenshin or soujiro. Therefore i still have to say kenshin would win.

No time limit would mean he didn't get burnt. The likkle fire technique he did, with the fire swirling around him... plzzz. Kenshin would just stand there and watch shishio burn himself to death.

...hehe. that was funny. You mean the Homuranama?

http://i56.photobucket.com/albums/g175/jerikun/vlcsnap-401679.png